AUGUST 1, 2004
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Q&A: Jim Spohrer
One-time venture capital man and currently Director, Services Research, IBM Almaden Research Lab, Jim Spohrer is betting big on the future of 'services sciences'. And while at it, he's also busy working with anthropologists and other social scientists who look quite out of place in a company of geeks. So what exactly is the man—and IBM's lab—up to?


NBIC Ambitions
NBIC? Well, Nanotech, Biotech, Infotech and Cognitive Sciences. They could pack quite some power, together.

More Net Specials
Business Today,  July 18, 2004
 
 
CROSSFIRE
In The Binary City
'You Cannot Create A Great Brand Without Advertising' was the debate's motion. Gurcharan Das spoke for. Nandan Nilekani against.
The heat is on: (L-R) Infosys' Nilekani and Gurcharan Das debate at the Business Today Crossfire

The Taj Presidency may not be the proper place to discuss what's civilised or not about Bangalore, located as the hotel is in that very city. But Suhel Seth, CEO Equus Red Cell and BT Crossfire moderator for the evening, took the liberty anyway. The three civilised aspects he spied were: "Its people, of course, the weather, and the fact that people come here on time."

Sponsored by Royal Challenge and held in association with Liberty, the debate's topic was 'You cannot create a great brand without advertising'. In support of the motion stood Gurcharan Das, playwright, former head of P&G India and author of Indian Unbound. And against it stood Nandan Nilekani, CEO, Infosys Technologies.

Das opened by making a case that even the PowerPoint presentations Nilekani goes about making for Infosys, are in fact a form of advertising. "Nandan understands that the human mind is not a computer. The human mind retains just around 5 per cent of what it sees and hears. To be in this 5 per cent, you need advertising. One, to occupy a distinct space, but two, to remind your customer about your brand," said Das, proceeding to cite the famous adworld quotation comparing building a brand without advertising to winking at a girl in the dark ("Only you know what you're doing").

Every business needs a competitive advantage, and needs to convey it to customers-for which advertising is a supremely effective method. If you hit upon a Big Idea, then this is all the more so, he added, citing the instance of Pidilite's 'fishing' commercial (which would make its point even on 'mute', his favourite test). That's not to imply, he cautioned, that a great brand can be created for a lousy product through brilliant advertising. "Advertising will give you awareness and trial, but you need performance for repeat purchase. It helps to also translate your brand equity into action."

MEASURE FOR MEASURE
"Our branding comes from our infrastructure. AGMs, annual reports, media coverage - these are key branding tools"
Nandan Nilekani, CEO, Infosys Technologies
"The human mind retains just around 5 per cent of what it sees and hears. To be in this, you need advertising"
Gurcharan Das, Former Head, P&G India
"The topics are always structured so that they never have complete resolution"
Suhel Seth, CEO, Equus Red Cell

That action, though, requires that the campaign be well-aimed at the chosen audience. "And I think this is where India Shining went wrong," said Das, "It was a great campaign, but was wrongly targeted." While investors responded to it, as per the original plan, common voters did not-since it was inapt as an election campaign.

To round up, Das narrated a little joke about a family that saw its family affairs as a sort of business, with dad being 'capital', mom 'management', baby 'the future', the maid 'labour'... and the little boy waking up late one night to find that, "This is one hell-of-a business. Management is asleep. Capital is exploiting labour, and the future stinks!"

Nilekani, at the other podium, opened with a touche. Pronouncing himself glad that Das had talked about P&G, Nilekani observed that "P&G itself is veering away from advertising". By way of example, he spoke of P&G's Operation Tremor, which employs hundreds of thousands of American teenagers to popularise a new launch. "It is using viral marketing and buzz to create a brand." This kind of thing cuts through the ad-clutter, he emphasised. People, he said, were turning numb under ad bombardment-barely even able to recall which ad is for which brand.

The big four brands from India that had achieved global recognition, meanwhile, were Infosys, IIT, Bangalore and India as an outsourcing hub, announced a proud Nilekani (interrupting him, Das added that many Americans have now heard of Bangalore but not the Taj Mahal). India has stormed the international media as an outsourcing hotspot. "Bill Gates is saying that India is well on its way to becoming a global economic power," he said, showing an American cartoon captioned, 'No, you may not outsource your homework to India'. "This is a brand which has penetrated everybody's mind. And this brand was created without spending, I'm sorry to tell you guys, without spending a penny on advertising."

The IIT brand, meanwhile, was built by its illustrious alumni in techland-and a Gates endorsement. And Dilbert jibes. And Bangalore? "Let's do a Bangalore!" even John Kerry had said. B-to-B is now 'Back to Bangalore', according to the Financial Times. "And most important," Nilekani added, "Bangalore is a verb. How many cities in the world become verbs? The last one was Shanghai. To be 'Shanghaied' is to be kidnapped. But there are T-shirts saying, 'Don't get Bangalored'."

Yes, and finally, Infosys-with a campus that has become a destination for dignitaries on India visits. "Our branding comes from our infrastructure," said the company's CEO, portraying the AGMs, the annual reports, the global media coverage, the fact of being a billion-dollar firm-all as key branding elements. "And not a cent on advertising."

On a lighter note: (L-R)
India Today's Editor Prabhu Chawla with Infosys CEO
Nandan Nilekani
Chilling out: (L-R) BPL's Rajeev Chandrasekhar with Feedback's V. Ravichandar and Infosys' Hema Ravichandar
Playing the audience: (L-R) NGO Janaagraha's Ramesh Ramanathan and wife Swati Ramanathan

Seth struck out with Barista as his own example of a brand built sans advertising. And with the two opposing arguments having been made, it was time for the real fighting to begin. Das, though, decided to re-enter the fray with, "Somebody said that because of the outsourcing controversy that Kerry created in the United States, India got $89 million worth of free advertising." To which, Nilekani promptly responded, "Alright, gentlemen. We're ready for drinks. He has conceded."

It was, perhaps, a case of premature articulation. For, itching though people were to hit the bar, plenty of hair-tearing was to come for the evening-particularly on the issue of what qualifies as advertising and what does not. A question of definitions.

"They calculated $89 million worth of free advertising," repeated Das. The publicity was measured, still, in advertising terms. But could a brand like Pantene, wondered Das, get that sort of publicity? Besides, all image-oriented communication aimed at audiences-even the charisma of leaders-is broadly 'advertising' (just as Bangalore is broadly taken to be a 'brand'). So to that extent, one can't do without it. "In the 17 minutes you spoke," said Das, "about nine minutes you spoke about your own company... what was that, advertising or communication?" In response, Nilekani flatly denied spending nine minutes on Infosys, and refused to call it 'advertising'.

Then came the Q&A session, and a voluble member of the audience insisted that any communication motivated by an objective should be called advertising. Another got up to back this logic with the argument that people yelling on horseback or from turrets in the old days was the advertising of its time, and now the media vehicles have changed with the advent of new technologies. So why have a hard-and-fast definition?

Yet another audience member asked Nilekani how Infosys could differentiate itself without ads. To this, the CEO spoke of "inspiring trust" and the "service experience", and added that Google was another great brand built purely on usage buzz.

But what about word-of-mouth, asked someone in the hall, going back to the argument over definitions-was that also 'advertising'? No, said Das. Nilekani agreed, shaking his head.

Then came some more questions that had entire debates woven into them, which gave Seth just the moment he needed to wind up the debate-with a fourth point to make on how civilised the city is. "Bangalore has this unique way of asking questions," he quipped, "We must pick it up. You have the question, then the answer, and then you're just looking for a 'yes' or 'no' from the speakers. You make the work so easy." Except that no winner was to be declared. As Seth put it, "The topics are always structured so that they never have complete resolution, much like most of our country, a country of paradoxes."

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